Me and hubby on a bike run to Black Rock, Joshua Tree
Apostate Kate2
JoinedPosts by Apostate Kate2
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340
Post your photos time!!!
by dobbie ini don't think we've had one for a while, i can't find the last one anyway!
so just to satisfy my curiosity it would be great to see some of your photos, of you, your family even your pets (they're family too!
) then i'll know if any of you do look like your avatars cos that's what i'm always wondering!
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JW's to be glorified at Holocaust event
by Apostate Kate2 inread from the bottom up.
i sent them an email.http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20070923/news/709230304/1018/services03/news/center_for_diversity_education_brings_anne_frank_a_history_for_today_to_asheville thanks for writing kathleen.
it is helpful to recieve a variety of viewpoints on this.
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Apostate Kate2
Beginners; I would no way condone the leadership being praised or glorified in their so called stand and I think what the Watchtower leadership did was cowardly and inexcusable but I believe that the rank and file JW who died should be remembered as much as anybody else. However they should be rememebered as individuals as opposed to being lumped together with their leadership if that makes sense.
Oh yes I agree. They were the ulitimate victims. Not suffering and dieing for a good cause like hiding Jews to protect them. The Catholics who the WT degrades did hide Jews. I had a professor who was a child during the holocaust. Nuns put their lives in danger to protect her life. Did JWs die for a good cause? No. If the Watchtower had told them to assist the Gestapo in locating Jews they would have.
Doug Mason; My ancestry is Jewish too and I have been researching them for some years.
There is any amount of information at www.jewishgen.org, with a Special Interest Group (SIG) for each country, such as for Germany (Gersig).This is how I learned of my ancestry too! I was told I was "German and English." I found out I had a genetic disease, was put on disability so I had plenty of time to research this genetic disease. The actual disease is celtic in origen but in the research I found that out family was not just German but Jewish. My mom showed me family pictures and they are very semitic looking for German. When I told my mom she was surprised but said that her cousins had been refused entrance into someplace in Maryland for being Jew. It brought it all together for mom. The Jewish records are incredible. I found GG on a handwritten boarding certificate.
Rebel; That was my petition while I was advocating with the US National Holocaust Museum to add wt documents to their library. They did! Those documents are among their most often requested items from their library, so everyone who requests them will have the opportunity to see the wt's own documents supporting Hitler. They will also see Penton's book.
Ah... bless you rebel. Maybe you can keep the thread to sign the petition active (btt) to get as many signitures as possible. I'll add that to a mailer that can follow all Holocaust memorials and presentations.
Harleu; Has the whole world gone mad? What on Earth? We are NOT Anti-Semitic. Never have been. It's so funny how you guys will believe anything you read in any book or magazine but if I came to your door with a Bible and tried to tell you the truth you would never believe.
Harleua, I have many of Russel's and Rutherford's books and read THEM to tell me what the Watchtower taught from the beginning. My goal is to collect every last one of them and read every last one of them. If I showed up at your door to tell you the truth about the Bible and the Watchtower you would ask me to leave. The Watchtower is not Jehovah's organization, it is Russel and Rutherfords, then the mysterious governing body.
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JW's to be glorified at Holocaust event
by Apostate Kate2 inread from the bottom up.
i sent them an email.http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20070923/news/709230304/1018/services03/news/center_for_diversity_education_brings_anne_frank_a_history_for_today_to_asheville thanks for writing kathleen.
it is helpful to recieve a variety of viewpoints on this.
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Apostate Kate2
I'll work on that tomorrow. Did you send the Hitler letters? I'll see if I can find a photocopy of the originals in German with the English translation. This would not take much time to do.
My family converted to Christianity. There is litttle family history as it seems g.grampa came over young and we know nothing about the rest of his family left in Germany. I haven't begun to research g.grandma yet but my mom thinks she was also German Jew converted to Christianity. They did not talk about it because of racism. They did not allow German to be spoken in the house either.
I hope more people will sign the petition. I will enclose that with the Hitler letters. Maybe we should start a thread just for the petition and keep it active. Surly we can get more than 35.
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JW's to be glorified at Holocaust event
by Apostate Kate2 inread from the bottom up.
i sent them an email.http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20070923/news/709230304/1018/services03/news/center_for_diversity_education_brings_anne_frank_a_history_for_today_to_asheville thanks for writing kathleen.
it is helpful to recieve a variety of viewpoints on this.
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Apostate Kate2
No doubt Moshe..but even knowing that it would take alot for me to make that call.
Why doesn't the holocaust memorial people even look into this? It is so disgusting.
I grew up thinking that the Holocaust was all about what Hitler did to the JW's. I had NO idea how many innocent Jews died. My Jewish great grandfather came to America from the Berlin ghetto in Germany before Hitler came to power. If he hadn't, my mother never would have been born, or my children or their children.
The only thing I wear on my neck is the Star of David, for many reasons.
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JW's to be glorified at Holocaust event
by Apostate Kate2 inread from the bottom up.
i sent them an email.http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20070923/news/709230304/1018/services03/news/center_for_diversity_education_brings_anne_frank_a_history_for_today_to_asheville thanks for writing kathleen.
it is helpful to recieve a variety of viewpoints on this.
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Apostate Kate2
Dang Moshe you get the "Assertive Watchtower Activist of the Year Award"
to you. I'm going to go take a shot of Saki in your honor right now
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JW's to be glorified at Holocaust event
by Apostate Kate2 inread from the bottom up.
i sent them an email.http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20070923/news/709230304/1018/services03/news/center_for_diversity_education_brings_anne_frank_a_history_for_today_to_asheville thanks for writing kathleen.
it is helpful to recieve a variety of viewpoints on this.
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Apostate Kate2
It may be. I just found the originator of the petition. It is Barbara Anderson so I'm sure she posted it on the forum. The forum is so active these days I miss alot.
Way to go Barbara {{{hugs}}}
AK
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JW's to be glorified at Holocaust event
by Apostate Kate2 inread from the bottom up.
i sent them an email.http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20070923/news/709230304/1018/services03/news/center_for_diversity_education_brings_anne_frank_a_history_for_today_to_asheville thanks for writing kathleen.
it is helpful to recieve a variety of viewpoints on this.
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Apostate Kate2
There is a petition. I signed it. It will ask you for a donation afterward but you do not have to give, your petition will still be counted.
Dear xxxx
Thank you for signing the "Stop Hiding the Watctower Society's Anti-Semitism" petition at iPetitions.com website.
Your signature is valuable and makes a real difference. Please encourage others to sign the petition as well. To do that, just forward the text below to everyone who might be interested:
------- FORWARD THIS TO YOUR FRIENDS -------
Hi,
I wanted to draw your attention to this important petition that I recently signed:
"Stop Hiding the Watctower Society's Anti-Semitism"
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/watchtower-hitler?e
I really think this is an important cause, and I'd like to encourage you to add your signature, too. It's free and takes less than a minute of your time.
Thanks!
---------------------------------------------
Once again, thanks for signing the petition!
Sincerely,
-iPetitions Campaigns Team -
25
JW's to be glorified at Holocaust event
by Apostate Kate2 inread from the bottom up.
i sent them an email.http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20070923/news/709230304/1018/services03/news/center_for_diversity_education_brings_anne_frank_a_history_for_today_to_asheville thanks for writing kathleen.
it is helpful to recieve a variety of viewpoints on this.
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Apostate Kate2
Take a copy of the Hitler letters and ask them why they promote JWs as part of the Holocaust memorial. I had no idea the Holocaust memorial included JWs as if they were persecuted for refusing to join the German Reich because of what they were doing to the Jews. I don't have a copy of the original letters but am putting them on my list.
HITLER LETTER-ENGLISH TRANSLATION
WATCH TOWER
BIBLE AND TRACT SOCIETY
PUBLISHERS OF THE BIBLE STUDENTS ASSOCIATION
GENERAL OFFICES: 117 ADAMS TREET BROOKLYN NEW YORK, U.S.A.
GERMAN BRANCH:
WACHTTURMSTR.1 - 19
MAGDEBURG
POSTSCH.-K.: MAGDEBURG 4042
TELEPHONE, MAGDEBURG 405 56,405 57, 405 58
RADIO AND CABLE ADDRESS: WATCHTOWER MAGDEBURG
Most Honored Mr. Chancellor:
On June 25, 1933, a 5,000-delegate convention of German Bible Students
(Jehovah's Witnesses), representing several million Germans who have been
friends and followers of this movement for many years, was held in the
Sporthalle Wilmersdorf in Berlin. The purpose of this meeting was to find
ways and means of making known to you, Mr. Chancellor, and to other high
government officials of the German Reich, as well as L=E4nder [state]
governments, the following:
In some parts of the country measures are being taken against an
association of earnest Christian men and women which has positive
Christianity as its foundation. Because of their origin, these measures can
be regarded as nothing less than the persecution of one group of Christians
by another, since the accusations which trigger them [the measures] are
levelled from clerical, especially Catholic, quarters and are untrue.
Absolutely convinced of the full objectivity of the government departments
and officials dealing with these matters, we nevertheless recognize that
because of the volume of our literature on one hand and because of the
heavy workload of the relevant case workers on the other, the content of
our literature and the purpose of our movement are judged in large part
incorrectly, specifically in accord with the views-which cause
prejudice-that our religious opponents bring against us.
=0CFor this reason the matters discussed at the convention have been set dow=
n
in the attached declaration of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society in
order to convey to you, Mr. Chancellor, and to the senior departments of
the governments of the German Reich and the L=E4nder as documentation of the
fact that German Bible Students intend only, as the sole objective of their
work, to lead mankind back to God and to witness to and give honor to the name
of Jehovah, the Almighty, the Father of our Lord and Redeemer, Jesus Christ,
here on the earth. We are secure in the knowledge that you, Mr. Chancellor,
will not let such activity be disturbed.
German Bible Student congregations are generally known as havens of true
reverence for the Almighty and as ardent custodians of careful biblical
research. Local police authorities must always affirm that Bible Students
definitely have to be counted as among those elements of the country and
people that love and support order. Their only mission is the recruitment
of human hearts that love God.
The Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society is the Bible Students'
organizational mission center (for Germany: with head offices in
Magdeburg).
The Brooklyn administration of the Watch Tower Society is and in the past
has been outstandingly friendly to Germany. For this reason, the president
of the Society and seven members of its Board of Directors in the United
States were sentenced to 80 years imprisonment because the president
refused to use two magazines published by him in the United States for war
propaganda against Germany. These two magazines, "The Watch Tower" and
"Bible Student" [The Bible Students Monthly] were the only magazines in the
United States which refused ]to publish] war propaganda against Germany and
were, for this reason, outlawed and suppressed in the United States during
the war.
In a similar manner, the administration of our Society not only refused to
participate in the horror propaganda against Germany, but it took a
position against it. This is emphasized by the attached Declaration which
refers to the fact that the circles which led [in promoting] horror
propaganda in the United States (commercialistic Jews and Catholics) are
also the most eager persecutors of our Society's work and its
administration. These and other statements in our Declaration are meant to
serve as a rejection of the slanderous claim that the Bible Students are
supported by Jews.The representative convention of these five thousand delegates took notice
with great satisfaction of the statement by the governing president of
Magdeburg that the connection between Bible Students and Communists or
Marxists, claimed by our clerical opponents, cannot be
substantiated (and thus is slanderous as well). A relevant press report in
the Magdeburg Daily News No. 104 of May 5, 1933 says:
A government declaration regarding the occupation of Bible Student
House.-The government press center announces: "Police occupation of
property owned by the Earnest Bible Students Association has been ended
since no incriminating material regarding a claimed Communist activity was
found."
=46urther: the Magdeburg Daily News No. 102 of May 3, 1933 [states]:
=46rom the office of the Bible Students' Association we have receive word
that the actions initiated by the police against the Watch Tower Society
and the Bible Students' Association have been completely ended. All
material was released because a careful search revealed that those
societies are not guilty either in a political or criminal way and because
it was further determined that both societies are absolutely apolitical and
strictly religious [in nature].-Upon our questioning, the government
confirmed the correctness of our report.
The representative convention of these five thousand delegate stressed
that, following these circumstances, it would find it beneath its dignity
to defend itself in future against the contemptible accusation of Marxist
or Communist activity. The delegates refuted the accusations of our
religious opponents, which are clearly a sign of religious competition.
They [the religious opponents] would prefer to throttle truthful herald of
warning with slander rather than [use] the Word c God.
=46urther, it was stated at the five-thousand-delegate convention-a expresse=
d
in the Declaration-that Bible Students are fighting for the same high,
ethical goals and ideals that the National Government a the German Reich
proclaimed regarding the relationship of man t God, namely: honesty of the
created towards the Creator!
At the convention, it was stated that there are no opposing views in the
relationship between German Bible Students and the National Government of
the German Reich, but that, to the contrary, respecting the purely
religious and apolitical goals and objectives of the Bible Students, it can
be said that these are in complete harmony with the similar goals of the
National Government of the German Reich.
Because of the supposedly harsh language of our literature, some of our
books were banned. The five-thousand-delegate convention pointed out in
this connection that the contents of our books that were objected t
referred only to circumstances in the Anglo-American World Empire
=0C and that it-especially England-is to be held responsible for the League
of Nations and the unjustified treaties and burdens placed on Germany. The
things said in the above-mentioned spirit are therefore directed-whether in
a financial, political, or Roman Catholic (ultramontane) sense-against the
oppressors of the German people and country, not against the Germany
struggling against these burdens. Thus the bans [on Bible Student
literature] are made absolutely incomprehensible.
To those various German L=E4nder in which there occurred bans on Bible
Student religious services, prohibitions of prayer meetings, etc., those
[Bible Students], who have waited for weeks for a just resolution of the
situation which is stifling to their religious life, expressed the
following:
We will continue to conform to the regulations of prohibition issued
[against us] because we are confident that you, Mr. Chancellor, or the
governments of the L=E4nder, will lift these measures-by which tens of
thousands of Christian men and women would fall victim to a martyrdom
reminiscent of that of the original Christians-once the true state of
affairs is known.
=46inally, this five-thousand-delegate convention stated that the Bible
Student-Watch Tower organization stands for the maintenance of order and the
security of the state as well as for the enhancement of the above mentioned,
religiously related high ideals of the National Government. In order to make
this known above all to you, Mr. Chancellor, as the Leader of the German
people, and to other high government officials of the Reich and the L=E4nder,
the sentiments expressed briefly above were set down in detail in the
attached Declaration.
The attached Declaration was read [publicly] by the secretary of the
five-thousand-delegate, Bible Student Convention, was approved unanimously
[by Convention delegates], and was adopted with the instruction that a
single copy of it and of the Convention Report be conveyed to the
Chancellor of the Reich and to other high officials of the Reich and the
L=E4nder.
This is done with the most respectful plea that the request expressed in
the Declaration be granted in a most positive manner: namely, to give a
commission [drawn] from within our midst the opportunity of making a
responsible exposition regarding the facts to you, Mr. Chancellor, or the
Minister of the Interior, personally. Failing that, [we request] that a
commission of men be appointed by you, Mr. Chancellor, who arc not
religiously prejudiced against us-that is of men who are themselves not by
profession interested in religious matters but who would alone truly
examine our concerns without prejudice and according to the just principles
enunciated by the Chancellor of the Reich him-
self. By these principles we mean the statements in Section 24 of Platform
of the National Socialist German Workers Party:
"We demand the freedom of all religious confessions in the state so long
they do not endanger its existence or conflict with the ethical and moral
beliefs of the German race.
The Party, as such, represents the viewpoint of positive Christianity
without associating itself with a specific confession. It opposes the
Jewish-materialist spirit domestically and abroad and is convinced that a
lasting recuperation our people can only happen from the inside out....''
We are firmly convinced that the National Government of German will find no
reason to hinder our services or missionary activities if are judged,
first, without religious prejudice and, second, according the Platform
points quoted above.
With anticipation of an early, positive assent [to our requests] a with the
assurance of our highest esteem, most honored Mr. Chancellor, we remain,
Most respectfully,
Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society Magdeburg
Anyone wishing to obtain photocopies of the original documents, may do so
by writing to
The Christian Quest.
652 W. Diversey Ave.,
Apt. 2W Addison, IL,
USA 60101. -
25
JW's to be glorified at Holocaust event
by Apostate Kate2 inread from the bottom up.
i sent them an email.http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20070923/news/709230304/1018/services03/news/center_for_diversity_education_brings_anne_frank_a_history_for_today_to_asheville thanks for writing kathleen.
it is helpful to recieve a variety of viewpoints on this.
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Apostate Kate2
Read from the bottom up. I sent them an email. http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20070923/NEWS/709230304/1018/SERVICES03/NEWS/Center_for_Diversity_Education_brings_Anne_Frank_A_History_for_Today_to_Asheville Thanks for writing Kathleen. It is helpful to recieve a variety of viewpoints on this. I have not heard of this particular point of view. We have worked for a number of years with Diana Zientek - who does a great job of educating from a broad perspective about what happened during the Holocaust. She will be speaking at the event on the Jehovah's Witness and educating about the various targets of the nazi's . I've attached an article from the US Memorial Holocaust Museum on the Witness community. I consider them an authority - though not exhaustive - on this subject. This offers another point of view which you might find interesting. Again, thanks for writing and I hope to see you at one of the programs. Deborah Miles
Sent: Monday, September 24, 2007 1:21 PM
To: info@annefrank-wnc.org
Subject: Jehovah's Witnesses On your press release you should know that the Jehovah's Witness will not tell the entire truth. The truth is that not only did Jehovah's Witnesses not pledge allegiance to the Nazi regime, not one of them fought to free the Jews or their own people for that matter. Please take the time to explore all the links on this reputable web site; The Watchtower and Hitler The Watchtower's Nazis Conflicts
A History of Watchtower Cowardliness and Witness perseverance
A historical analysis of the Jehovah's Witnesses' during World War II concluded that they experienced extreme conflicts with Nazi Germany and probably withstood the attacks against them better than most groups. Their experience has been analyzed by a number of researchers including camp inmates and administrators who have concluded that their strong religious faith, community and social pressure to conform were all critical in helping Witnesses to withstand the Nazi assault against them. A major reason Witnesses endured was because to capitulate to the Nazis meant disfellowshipping and cutting off from what was often their only social support, their fellow Witnesses. Often the Witnesses as people showed exemplary behavior, but the Watchtower administration not uncommonly displayed immoral or deceitful behavior and even denigrated the Jews in an effort to save the German Watchtower branch. Although partly to blame for the tragedy, the Watchtower unscrupulously exploits it today to try to prove their claim of being God's only representatives on earth today.
Jerry Bergman, Ph.D Your press release; "A screening and discussion of Standing Firm will be held at 7 p.m. Tuesday, Oct. 9, at the exhibit in Biltmore Square Mall. The film examines the Jehovah's Witness community in Europe during World War II and their refusal to pledge allegiance to the Nazi regime. Consequently, these Christians were among the first victims of the Holocaust. Following the film, local educator and Jehovah's Witness Diana Zientek will discuss "Jehovah's Witness Stand Firm Against Nazi Assault." The memory of Anne Frank deserves better that to have a Jehovah's Witness speak at this event. Sincerely, Kathleen xxxxx -
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Rick Ross on Court TV Jami Floyd on cults
by Apostate Kate2 in.
it's on right now.. they are getting into cult psychology with the warren jeffs trial.
of course the watchtower is not mentioned but rick ross believes wt is one.
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Apostate Kate2
a cult is a cult is a cult is a cult....
different flavors same suckers
(((Dogpatch)))